modding general

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Re: modding general

Post by Mac B on July 17th 2018, 4:54 pm

I've outlined in the chat that I would be replacing aristocracy's nationalism-uniques and change them from the dumb barbarian mercenary units they get to a mercenary system that opens up a few locked units that operates on a by-civ basis

so in the theme of your kingdom having an aristocracy that can employ less than loyal-to-their-homeland mercenaries that aren't just barbarians that come out of nowhere it's going to be stuff like regional-sensewise things like maybe indians getting battle elephants. this is reflected in the original game with byzantines getting camels


im gonna draft up a quick brainstorm of what each civ will get with the combo. the main idea is to give the civ a few more defense-favorable bonuses instead of outright accentuating what theyre already good at - like giving an infantry civ more cavalry options - this will be the idea for the majority but for some its just going to stay with more minor units



Aristocracy-Nationalism Unlocked Units
Britons: Hand Cannoneers, Bombard Cannon
Byzantines: Heavy Scorp, SO
Celts: Bombard Cannon (What else am I gonna give them? Eagle warriors? Arbalests?)
Chinese: Battle Elephant (Non Elite) Hand Cannoneer
Franks: Heavy Camel, Arbalist
Goths: Elite Cannon Galleon
Japanese: Battle Elephants (non elte) Hussar
Mongols: Halberdier, Paladin
Persians: Arbalist
Saracens: Elite Battle Elephant, maybe Cavalier
Teutons: Heavy Camel, Light Cavalry
Turks: Arbalist, Pikeman
Vikings: Heavy Cav Archer, Hussar, Elite Eagle Warriors (Because the Vikings fucked America)

Aztecs: Galleon, Heavy Demo, Hand Cannon (Stealing the white mans guns)
Huns: Champion, Arbalist, Camel (Basic)
Koreans: Heavy scorpion, Heavy Camel
Mayans: Champion, Hussar (Hussar since they obv dont get defense upgrades for cav)
Spanish: Elite Eagle Warrior, Arbalist

Incas: Cavalier
Indians: Elite Battle Elephant, Arbalist
Italians: Halberdier, Heavy Cav Archer, Paladin, Heavy Scorpion
Magyars: Siege Ram and Onager, Heavy Demo
Slavs: Hand Cannoneer, Heavy Camel
Berbers: Paladin
Ethiopians: Hand Cannon
Malians: Hussar
Portuguese: Heavy Cav Archer, Paladin,

Burmese: Paladin, Heavy Camel (maybe)
Khmer: Champion
Malay: I Really Want To Put Champion But I'll Wait Before Deciding, until then it's Hand Cannoneer because apparently they were using matchlock guns during battles against portugal
Vietnamese: Heavy Camel, Hussar

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Re: modding general

Post by GRYPHON DEFENDER ALYAZA on July 17th 2018, 6:01 pm

favorable bonuses instead of outright accentuating what theyre already good at

berber paladins?

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Re: modding general

Post by Mac B on July 17th 2018, 7:09 pm

i said for the most part


i put down berbers as paladins as a joke
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Re: modding general

Post by Mac B on July 17th 2018, 7:17 pm

giving spanish arbalist was a joke too
i gotta put down hilarious ideas when writing these to break up the mold of mulling over 7 tabs of military history of malaysia to see any historical inaccuracies that i can fill
i might actually put (the jokes) in for the next release but theyll be padded out in subsequent balance patches


on that topic theres going to be 2 secret units 3 if i can modify audio files
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Re: modding general

Post by GRYPHON DEFENDER ALYAZA on July 17th 2018, 7:39 pm

chinese - unlock entire tech tree

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Re: modding general

Post by Mac B on July 17th 2018, 8:03 pm

if chinese research feudalism, dynasty, nationalism, and cultural dominance, and raze 100 buildings, they unlock the entire tech tree
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Re: modding general

Post by Mac B on July 26th 2018, 6:29 pm

Since the initial wave of the third unique techs were designed a bit hastily I'm going back and changing ones that suck ass. It'll be a little slower process but that's because I want to take a good balance and give/take perspective to it more.
This is what I have so far

Changed UTs:
Ethiopians: Bet Giorgis Cavalry - Mounted units do +6 against other cavalry.
(the effect was a tie between giving the cavalry extra speed, giving the cavalry extra melee armor, or something like this. i ruled out extra melee armor to adhere to the balance of them not getting plate barding and speed for them not getting husbandry. Since against bigger contenders like their Malian cousins or indians I wanted to give them a decent foot in the game on cavalry that can match up a bit. I considered giving them trample damage but that seems too good for a unit composition that isn't centered on cavalry - either way I'm trying not to borrow too much from the ideas i have for civs what with the burgundian gendarme having the same effect as a knight with bonus vs cav, but im getting off topic here)


(I looked a ways around trying to find any strong historical analogues for a third unique tech for ethiopians [cuz kaskara is a shitty Chieftans knockoff] but there wasn't much that wasn't reflected in the game except for how they possibly had elephants in their army, which can be reflected with an aristocracy-nationalism thing. I did read a few tidbits alluding to axum empire history and some factions being, for all intended purposes, crusaders that defended christians from bandits on pilgrimages and roads. This was during my all-day time at the hospital the other day so I can't really find the references but as Axum was becoming a christian state around the time I'm gonna run with it. The name comes from the total war unit which is a reference to the church they have there)

Aztecs: Sacrifice - Your tax increases by a factor of how many of your units die.

For balance reasons I am limiting their tax research to Kingdoms or Vassals. In the same vein that the Huns tax does, this tech can, after a certain point, spiral out of control and give you sacrilegious amounts of gold. Alternatively, for a more simple, concrete way it could be so that your dead units return some resources when they die (epoch suggested this for units you kill)
If I went this way it would be something like returns 70% of the unit's gold cost.

Malay: Meriam Kecil - Bombards fire 20% faster


Last edited by Mac B on August 16th 2018, 4:32 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: modding general

Post by Mac B on August 16th 2018, 4:27 pm

Trying to balance the civ ideas in my notebook as much as possible
I'm struggling making the Tibetan unique unit
My first idea was a magyar-huszar-like light cavalry/cataphract mix with really low pierce armor (Because their infantry has huskarl levels of pierce armor) that attacks fast and has extra horse armor

Then I read about how the tibetan elite cavalry were cataphracts that wore full mail armor (like their infantry) and were distinguished by buddhist symbols of peacock feathered armor

So I wen't to the idea of slow heavy cavalry with really high pierce armor
But that's an issue because that leaves them with few weaknesses against archer civs because their infantry already fills that role (even though itd make sense because their cavalry were just mounted infantry

Then I read some source that said there are no sources that suggest their cavalry attacked in gallop and most would dismount to fight

So I had the idea of a cavalry unit thats fast but has really low hp and spawns an infantry unit when it dies - although that would be badass it seems really impractical to have as a unique unit

So I'm back to square one with the idea of it being medium cavalry with abstract bonuses, maybe something like healing. I considered maybe an infantry unit instead but their barracks already produces exceptional infantry with the extra pierce armor and castle age extra armor tech, and the only thing theyre lacking in niche that could be filled by a unique unit is mobility (especially since i didnt give those mofuckers squires), which a cavalry unit would be good for.



Aformentioned source also had a really unelaborated remark that was basically "Tibetans were good at siege craft" and I didn't intend for them to be a siege civ but I can throw in Siege ram - siege onager would be overkill because it would be pure hell trying to take out SOs guarded by an army of 5/9 armor champions and super-illumination monks

Surprisingly, there's not many resources on the military of the Tibetan empire, or even information on battles that don't come off as summaries
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Re: modding general

Post by He. on August 19th 2018, 11:05 am

why don't we take age of empires and move it somewhere else?
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Re: modding general

Post by GRYPHON DEFENDER ALYAZA on August 24th 2018, 1:11 pm

Mac B wrote:
Then I read some source that said there are no sources that suggest their cavalry attacked in gallop and most would dismount to fight

So I had the idea of a cavalry unit thats fast but has really low hp and spawns an infantry unit when it dies - although that would be badass it seems really impractical to have as a unique unit

So I'm back to square one with the idea of it being medium cavalry with abstract bonuses, maybe something like healing. I considered maybe an infantry unit instead but their barracks already produces exceptional infantry with the extra pierce armor and castle age extra armor tech, and the only thing theyre lacking in niche that could be filled by a unique unit is mobility (especially since i didnt give those mofuckers squires), which a cavalry unit would be good for.
well im surprised you arent making more use of the trebuchet pack and unpack function, when i learned you could apply that to any unit ive drafted several unique units with that function in mind
you could just have it where it spawns as a some generic medium cavalry unit that can switch between that and a dismounted infantry unit


Aformentioned source also had a really unelaborated remark that was basically "Tibetans were good at siege craft" and I didn't intend for them to be a siege civ but I can throw in Siege ram - siege onager would be overkill because it would be pure hell trying to take out SOs guarded by an army of 5/9 armor champions and super-illumination monks

Surprisingly, there's not many resources on the military of the Tibetan empire, or even information on battles that don't come off as summaries
just give em siege ram and siege engineers and call it a day

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Re: modding general

Post by Mac B on August 24th 2018, 1:36 pm

DAD wrote:well im surprised you arent making more use of the trebuchet pack and unpack function, when i learned you could apply that to any unit ive drafted several unique units with that function in mind
you could just have it where it spawns as a some generic medium cavalry unit that can switch between that and a dismounted infantry unit
that and something like a packed version thats a cavalry archer were all in consideration - i want to do something like that but the problem with that is that it's just impractical to use in a real game setting aside from the fact theres some kajiggering with tricking the program to do that.

DAD wrote:just give em siege ram and siege engineers and call it a day
yeah basically
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Re: modding general

Post by Mac B on August 24th 2018, 1:45 pm

aside from that theres not a lot of room for a norman unique unit since they produce some of the best heavy cavalry on the same rank as the franks and in trying to distance them as a civ from them looking at the history it gets harder because their late armies were virtually indistinguishable as they consisted mostly of knights, crossbows, and axe wielding infantry. im between either an infantry unique unit to deal with spearmen (which would be an axeman clone/berserk clone) or an elite heavy cavalry unit (which would be a boyar clone thats also moot because they produce op cavalry from the stables)
since theyre so similar to the franks already (and in the game are represented as them) i might completely make a new civ and recycle their bonuses, i was thinking about possible ones for that last night
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Re: modding general

Post by Mac B on August 26th 2018, 1:52 pm

following that up after several weeks of pouring over briefs of several norman battles and being affirmed that their victories were almost entirely wrought by their exceptional cavalry (supported by xbows_ and strategy ive decided that the closest thing I can round up to a unique unit is something like a maceman that, gonna be real, is still going to fill the same niche as throwing axemen and berserks as trash killers - mostly because theres just not much to work with in and all i found that isn't already reflected in the game (such as having lords and barons filling the roles of elite heavy cavalry represented by paladins) is that the mace was a weapon occasionally used by their infantry. if there was some unique siege engine that they used which nothing of the sort could i find, id probably make it the unique unit instead (but the normans didnt really need that, theyd just garrison a town before an army arrived, repel ladders, and charge every now and again
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